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It is just insane that they would in one breath say they are rewriting the game and graphics engine for performance, specifically multithreading performance, but in the same breath say they are going to use DX9 for graphics and 32bit small memory executable for the game engine.
http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/bb147224(v=vs.85).aspx
DX9 cannot multithread properly from a graphics standpoint. It basically means that one core is always going to be wasted on graphics and constantly checking to make sure it is not calling something the rest of the game needs. There is a reason they rewrote DirectX from the ground up with new APIs and libraries when they made 10 and 11.
The 32bit small memory issue means the game can never use more than 2GB no matter how many you have available and will call on more swap file use because of this limit. Terrible.
If it was an expansion I would understand, but writing an engine from the Ground Up post 2009... you have got to be kidding me.
Egosoft and Rebirth
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Egosoft and Rebirth
BarrenEarth
Proguey (12)
Proguey (12)
Posted 11 years ago.
Fallent
Fightguey (6)
Fightguey (6)
Posted 11 years ago.
"How would my system specs run the game on the highest settings, what average FPS would i be looking at? thanks"
"We honestly dont know yet. This system is definitely well prepared but in terms of graphics settings there is NO maximum simply because the graphic detail level can always be set to "MORE"
"
From their youtube. They don't even know what system specs it will require yet
"We honestly dont know yet. This system is definitely well prepared but in terms of graphics settings there is NO maximum simply because the graphic detail level can always be set to "MORE"
"
From their youtube. They don't even know what system specs it will require yet
Raptor
Instruguey (13)
Instruguey (13)
Posted 11 years ago.
The 32bit small memory issue means the game can never use more than 2GB no matter how many you have available and will call on more swap file use because of this limit.
I believe a 32-bit application can normally run on a 64-bit (and 32-bit of course) OS and hence can normally use any amount of available memory (even more than 2 GB if necessary).
Besides, the CPU and the graphics card (GPU and video memory) are of the most concern. I'm saying if you have a good hardware and a 64-bit (or 32-bit) windows 7 or 8, then you can run the game flawlessly
and in the same time the graphics level/details/effects are at least better than previous games 
It does not matter what we were in the past but what we are now, what we do and what we are going to be, our destiny.
Roguey
Trueguey (22)
Trueguey (22)
Posted 11 years ago.
thanks for guys posting links to the egosoft posts. To be honest I forgot about them - although in my defence its been awhile!
as for dx9 API, it does seem a bit backwards (for a game which isnt even out yet). Windows XP is an old operating system and a lot has changed since - more memory (4Gb+), 64bit, dx10/11+ etc. If egosoft are basing the engine around XP code, then I agree with you - it sounds like rebirth is might be like X3/tc/ap with multi-core support (something we kindof should of had).
Hopefully egosoft have revised their API, and created a dx11 version as well (maybe the reason for the delay?). I have recently been been playing Tomb raider on the PC (dx11), and the graphics there look way more impressive than the rebirth shots (ie. TR (my pc) vs X-R). btw, I have tress hair on in TR, which renders each piece of hair on lara (as you can guess it does take quite a lot of performance, but is still running 40+fps).
It got me the graphic guy working on LOD, didnt know which cards supported Shader Model 3.0. I would of thought if its your job, you would kind-of know which gpus supported SM3.0, wouldnt ya?
as for dx9 API, it does seem a bit backwards (for a game which isnt even out yet). Windows XP is an old operating system and a lot has changed since - more memory (4Gb+), 64bit, dx10/11+ etc. If egosoft are basing the engine around XP code, then I agree with you - it sounds like rebirth is might be like X3/tc/ap with multi-core support (something we kindof should of had).
Hopefully egosoft have revised their API, and created a dx11 version as well (maybe the reason for the delay?). I have recently been been playing Tomb raider on the PC (dx11), and the graphics there look way more impressive than the rebirth shots (ie. TR (my pc) vs X-R). btw, I have tress hair on in TR, which renders each piece of hair on lara (as you can guess it does take quite a lot of performance, but is still running 40+fps).
From their youtube. They don't even know what system specs it will require yet
It got me the graphic guy working on LOD, didnt know which cards supported Shader Model 3.0. I would of thought if its your job, you would kind-of know which gpus supported SM3.0, wouldnt ya?
BarrenEarth
Proguey (12)
Proguey (12)
Posted 11 years ago.
Raptor, you can run a 32 bit application on a 128 bit OS doesn't matter. The application cannot call on more than 2 GB of memory unless it was written with large memory addressing, then it can use 4 GB.
Also, DX9 cannot use Windows 7 WDDM memory optimizations.
There is a reason when WOW released Catalyst they did an experimental DX11/64bit version and with no change to graphics settings, on patched up code, users saw a 25-35% performance increase. In order to use Win7 properly, you need a 64bit executable and DX10/11.
Also you can run a DX11 game on older hardware as long as you have win7. DX11 scales down to DX9 cards and you are not kept from playing the game...
Also, DX9 cannot use Windows 7 WDDM memory optimizations.
There is a reason when WOW released Catalyst they did an experimental DX11/64bit version and with no change to graphics settings, on patched up code, users saw a 25-35% performance increase. In order to use Win7 properly, you need a 64bit executable and DX10/11.
Also you can run a DX11 game on older hardware as long as you have win7. DX11 scales down to DX9 cards and you are not kept from playing the game...
BarrenEarth
Proguey (12)
Proguey (12)
Posted 11 years ago.
thanks for guys posting links to the egosoft posts. To be honest I forgot about them - although in my defence its been awhile!
as for dx9 API, it does seem a bit backwards (for a game which isnt even out yet). Windows XP is an old operating system and a lot has changed since - more memory (4Gb+), 64bit, dx10/11+ etc. If egosoft are basing the engine around XP code, then I agree with you - it sounds like rebirth is might be like X3/tc/ap with multi-core support (something we kindof should of had).
Hopefully egosoft have revised their API, and created a dx11 version as well (maybe the reason for the delay?). I have recently been been playing Tomb raider on the PC (dx11), and the graphics there look way more impressive than the rebirth shots (ie. TR (my pc) vs X-R). btw, I have tress hair on in TR, which renders each piece of hair on lara (as you can guess it does take quite a lot of performance, but is still running 40+fps).
From their youtube. They don't even know what system specs it will require yet
It got me the graphic guy working on LOD, didnt know which cards supported Shader Model 3.0. I would of thought if its your job, you would kind-of know which gpus supported SM3.0, wouldnt ya?
- Roguey
as for dx9 API, it does seem a bit backwards (for a game which isnt even out yet). Windows XP is an old operating system and a lot has changed since - more memory (4Gb+), 64bit, dx10/11+ etc. If egosoft are basing the engine around XP code, then I agree with you - it sounds like rebirth is might be like X3/tc/ap with multi-core support (something we kindof should of had).
Hopefully egosoft have revised their API, and created a dx11 version as well (maybe the reason for the delay?). I have recently been been playing Tomb raider on the PC (dx11), and the graphics there look way more impressive than the rebirth shots (ie. TR (my pc) vs X-R). btw, I have tress hair on in TR, which renders each piece of hair on lara (as you can guess it does take quite a lot of performance, but is still running 40+fps).
From their youtube. They don't even know what system specs it will require yet
It got me the graphic guy working on LOD, didnt know which cards supported Shader Model 3.0. I would of thought if its your job, you would kind-of know which gpus supported SM3.0, wouldnt ya?
- Roguey
As far as the tech specs... the problem they are running into on that level is they are all working on Windows 7 machines... when you go to Microsoft to get your fancy sticker that says you have a game for windows, they would most likely not want you listing any graphics cards that were not DX10 compatible, since DX9 is not native supported.
Take a look at your games you have now. The ones like terran conflict do not list that they are compatible with Windows 7, they list XP and Vista SP1... Because they also have graphics cards that are not native supported in Windows 7 like 6600GTs.
Probably just semantics really, but hard to get official tech specs listed when Microsoft is going to fight them because of the obvious marketing push towards 7, 8 and DX11/11.1
Raptor
Instruguey (13)
Instruguey (13)
Posted 11 years ago.
Hello again,
Indeed a 64-bit version of the game with DX11 support could provide much higher performance, but they said:
I guess sooner or later there will be a need for an upgraded X Rebirth Engine (a DX11/64-bit engine), I mean we shall just wait until the release then worry if the game isn't that fine but don't worry, if the game is to run on even lower machines, then high-end machines can run the game at its maximum graphics settings at reasonable frame-rate while the game graphics is quite wonderful?
Indeed a 64-bit version of the game with DX11 support could provide much higher performance, but they said:
X Rebirth will run on DX9 API as long as all the features that we need from the API are possible with it. That does not mean we may not at some point also support DX11, but for now we do not see a need. Our engine is quite different from all the big established names, because it is designed specifically for a space game. We had a look at engines like Unreal or the CryEngine, but because we wanted to have cutting edge space graphics, an area very different from what these engines are specialized in, we had to develop our own engine.
- Egosoft Director, Bernd
- Egosoft Director, Bernd
I guess sooner or later there will be a need for an upgraded X Rebirth Engine (a DX11/64-bit engine), I mean we shall just wait until the release then worry if the game isn't that fine
but don't worry, if the game is to run on even lower machines, then high-end machines can run the game at its maximum graphics settings at reasonable frame-rate while the game graphics is quite wonderful?
It does not matter what we were in the past but what we are now, what we do and what we are going to be, our destiny.
BarrenEarth
Proguey (12)
Proguey (12)
Posted 11 years ago.
I guess it is all talk for nothing... right now we have a 0 bit version with IndirectY nothing... because it isn't out yet. 
Raptor
Instruguey (13)
Instruguey (13)
Posted 11 years ago.
Just as you said, a 0-bit that will run on even Pentium-I 133 MHz CPU system or even Nintendo or Atari... No just kidding
It does not matter what we were in the past but what we are now, what we do and what we are going to be, our destiny.
Raptor
Instruguey (13)
Instruguey (13)
Posted 11 years ago.
Hopefully egosoft have revised their API, and created a dx11 version as well (maybe the reason for the delay?)
That would be a surprise, but rather I think they aren't creating a DX11 version to avoid more delay of the release date, or why do you think they aren't (if that's true) at creating a DX11 alternative?
I have recently been playing Tomb raider on the PC (dx11), and the graphics there look way more impressive than the rebirth shots
But guys I see the graphics of Rebirth (in the trailer) is way more impressive than the previous X Universe! is it just me?!
It does not matter what we were in the past but what we are now, what we do and what we are going to be, our destiny.
BarrenEarth
Proguey (12)
Proguey (12)
Posted 11 years ago.
They are just using higher resolution rendering... they are probably pushing the limits of resolution with that version of D3D though.
The reason they are not going to DX11 is simple, they want to do everything in house and their guys have no training what so ever on how to code for DX10/11 now. It is completely different. Their own graphics hardware guy in the english video didn't even know what graphics cards would be required to use SM3.0 (Hint... Just about all made in the last decade do.)
Actually it is funny because if SM3.0 is a requirement, then 99% of the video cards that support it would also run DX11 even if it was in strip down mode. lol
You don't actually buy that crap that they couldn't find any, not one, not even close to one graphics engine out there they could use... claiming none fit the space genre, even though Chris Roberts was all to happy to have 3 to choose from that would have worked fine.
The reason they are not going to DX11 is simple, they want to do everything in house and their guys have no training what so ever on how to code for DX10/11 now. It is completely different. Their own graphics hardware guy in the english video didn't even know what graphics cards would be required to use SM3.0 (Hint... Just about all made in the last decade do.)
Actually it is funny because if SM3.0 is a requirement, then 99% of the video cards that support it would also run DX11 even if it was in strip down mode. lol
You don't actually buy that crap that they couldn't find any, not one, not even close to one graphics engine out there they could use... claiming none fit the space genre, even though Chris Roberts was all to happy to have 3 to choose from that would have worked fine.
Raptor
Instruguey (13)
Instruguey (13)
Posted 11 years ago.
By the way, could you tell me of one space game, since 2010 until now, that is as much complex, multi-role and wonderful as X3 or better? I think X3 is the best (in complexity at least) space game till now.
It does not matter what we were in the past but what we are now, what we do and what we are going to be, our destiny.
BarrenEarth
Proguey (12)
Proguey (12)
Posted 11 years ago.
Independence War 2: Edge of Chaos for it's time was revolutionary.
Eve-Online is far larger and more complex, stark differences though.
Freespace 2
Wing Commander IV
Evochron Mercenary
Notch is making a sandbox space game based on the Firefly universe, just hope he does it with better graphics than minecraft.
Look, X3 was very unique and special no doubt. It however is not very deep. Once you make your money and get your fleet there is very little to do. There is no end game content. It is not hard to get to the point where you can wipe out whole sectors, and the saving grace of the game is that mods have made it more interesting and extended it's life.
Please remember that you are a fan, and I am a fan... but outside independent reviewers tend to look at Egosoft's work as crap. I think Reunion had the best scores at a 7/10. There is just so much potential here that is being wasted. I wish I had the time and resources to make a game myself, but I don't... so I give my money to Chris Roberts and pray he doesn't put Egosoft out of business.
Eve-Online is far larger and more complex, stark differences though.
Freespace 2
Wing Commander IV
Evochron Mercenary
Notch is making a sandbox space game based on the Firefly universe, just hope he does it with better graphics than minecraft.
Look, X3 was very unique and special no doubt. It however is not very deep. Once you make your money and get your fleet there is very little to do. There is no end game content. It is not hard to get to the point where you can wipe out whole sectors, and the saving grace of the game is that mods have made it more interesting and extended it's life.
Please remember that you are a fan, and I am a fan... but outside independent reviewers tend to look at Egosoft's work as crap. I think Reunion had the best scores at a 7/10. There is just so much potential here that is being wasted. I wish I had the time and resources to make a game myself, but I don't... so I give my money to Chris Roberts and pray he doesn't put Egosoft out of business.
BarrenEarth
Proguey (12)
Proguey (12)
Posted 11 years ago.
Come on... they did this back in 1998 before anyone even knew what a graphics card was.
And this, almost a decade later. You tell me... is it worth the pretty ship to have a crap story line?
Roguey
Trueguey (22)
Trueguey (22)
Posted 11 years ago.
when I was saying about Tomb-raider, I was just using that has a example. I havnt played a lot of PC games recently. For me that has got some impressive graphics (although being away from a PC for awhile, I guess it would). When I look at screenshots from Tomb-raider, and screenshots from X-Rebirth - I think Tomb raider looks more impressive. Maybe thats unfair, although I can get the pictures myself, as its out and here.
has for the rebirth trailer: its hard to say, it does look good but there are a lot of moving cameras and that. Large planet textures and lots of moving objects arent that demanding on modern hardware. Take this pic in TR; there is a lot of things there, moving oceans, plants etc. even 1000's of hair strands on lara's head being worked-out (tressfx). Tressfx is said not to run all that well on nvidia hardware but yet its still doing it at 40+fps. TR is using multi-able cores, DX11, CUDA cores (on my gpu) and Win7 (64bit).
Now take rebirth, okay its a big leap from X3TC/AP however thats kind-of respected with the use of multi-core cpu's and modern hardware. When egosoft came out with them shots in 1998 they were impressive, but a lot has changed since. Are rebirth screenies really wow factor (like before in 1998 )?
I guess things like gpu core support are out of the picture (ie. CUDA-core support) in rebirth? I guess its all sounding 'old' before its out, and saying only DX9 isnt helping things.
Although all this is graphics talk, most important is the game-play.
has for the rebirth trailer: its hard to say, it does look good but there are a lot of moving cameras and that. Large planet textures and lots of moving objects arent that demanding on modern hardware. Take this pic in TR; there is a lot of things there, moving oceans, plants etc. even 1000's of hair strands on lara's head being worked-out (tressfx). Tressfx is said not to run all that well on nvidia hardware but yet its still doing it at 40+fps. TR is using multi-able cores, DX11, CUDA cores (on my gpu) and Win7 (64bit).
Now take rebirth, okay its a big leap from X3TC/AP however thats kind-of respected with the use of multi-core cpu's and modern hardware. When egosoft came out with them shots in 1998 they were impressive, but a lot has changed since. Are rebirth screenies really wow factor (like before in 1998 )?
I guess things like gpu core support are out of the picture (ie. CUDA-core support) in rebirth? I guess its all sounding 'old' before its out, and saying only DX9 isnt helping things.
Although all this is graphics talk, most important is the game-play.
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