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Questions by Redheart, Answers by you
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Questions by Redheart, Answers by you
redheart
Eagleguey (11)
Eagleguey (11)
Posted 10 years ago.
So I want to get opinions, What is better to use....trade-sell for best price.....or using cls to set up trade routes?
tstoff
Fightguey (6)
Fightguey (6)
Posted 10 years ago.
I got say I'm not really into the whole cls cag thing yet, most of my non self-suf factories have two or three TS (some to get wares others to sell) and give me some nice money, the others a little bit more, it takes some micromanagement I know, but I'm more used to it, than to embrace another strategy. They have been working fine, I have like 200 million cr... but yeah I'm willing to learn one of these days.
"a nation who forgets its defenders will itself be forgotten"
Kirlack
Specoguey (14)
Specoguey (14)
Posted 10 years ago.
So I want to get opinions, What is better to use....trade-sell for best price.....or using cls to set up trade routes?
- redheart
- redheart
If you're building a factory that will trade with the locals, I'd always go the CAG route, rather than best buy/best sell freighters. A single CAG can often cover 3-4 ships worth of work. That also applies to open loop (non self sufficient) complexes, although you'll need more ships to keep up with the demand. In my experience, setting your station buying prices to avg +1 and your selling price to avg -1 will keep your CAG busy forever.
You can't assign an Apprentice level CAG pilot into a closed loop complex though, as he won't have any wares to buy, and can't level up. If you're going to build closed loops, I'd suggest getting your pilots up to at least Trader level doing something else.
The pricing is the real difference between the trading methods, redheart. In a CLS network you can get away with buying at minimum price, because you're the only customer. You can't regularly do that with the other trading methods. The trade off (no pun intended
), is that you lay out more initially to fund the CLS network, but it can make that money back very quickly 
LOL, I just took out a group of fighters with an osprey with a hammerhead from 5k away. Nice way to get assassination missions done FAST!..Thanks for the knowledge Kirlack!
- redheart
- redheart
:D
Busters are a favourite choice of mine, but any M4/M3 (no turrets) should be viable options. It won't always work, sometimes the mark's just outside the blast radius by the time it reaches, sometimes another ship will get in the way, but it's a great quick way to wipe out a whole bunch of ships and get paid for the privilege!
Madder than a Bastard on fathers day.
My DiDs: Peace(s) of Eight - Way of the Gun - Status: Online, A Xenon DiD
My DiDs: Peace(s) of Eight - Way of the Gun - Status: Online, A Xenon DiD
redheart
Eagleguey (11)
Eagleguey (11)
Posted 10 years ago.
Kirkland, uh...I never have used the commercial agent before. I usually will just straight out trade/sell for highest, but now I have started to set up a CLS to sell products to waypoints at average price. Could you just outline, you dont have to go into deep detail, what the cag is? Please? and how do you keep track of what they are doing so you can tell if you are making a profit?
Zipmeister
Fightguey (6)
Fightguey (6)
Posted 10 years ago.
I have a CAg (Springblossom) based at a teladi trading station (Chose Teladi because they can dock unlimited fighters and ships don't get clipped by spinny bits like the Terran version)
I add wares to the station to buy at max price via dockware manager that I want to collect. Give it some money and set the Commercial Agent to buy stuff.
I have the station set to my ships only. (The difference in price between max and purchase price goes back in my pocket)
A parked Atmospheric Lifter with freight drones removes goods (Manually) when I want to have more than the station's carry capacity.
When I need to outfit a ship, I pull up next to the lifter, send over the drones to retrieve goods and transporter them across.
I don't have to go searching for goods around the universe to outfit ships. They are brought to me automatically.
(Note, This convenience does not MAKE money, it costs money)
CAg has it's own blacklist. You will want to blacklist war sectors and any sectors that will cause the pilot to fly through the war sectors.
External CLS is good on a fighter with decent cargo hold (Falcon Hauler).
If you homebase the fighter on a carrier type ship and set it to buy energy, the carrier ship can be used as a flying refueling station for capitals via a transporter device. (I believe supply command software allows you to refuel ships if you don't like to use the selection bar for a transfer amount via transporter)
Fly by and refuel. The CLS tops up what you take.
Park aforementioned carrier next to one of your SPP's, Drop a Jump beacon and refueling becomes easy for your slow capitals.
A spare Galleon(M1) or a Shrike(M7) stolen from a claim mission will do nicely.
I add wares to the station to buy at max price via dockware manager that I want to collect. Give it some money and set the Commercial Agent to buy stuff.
I have the station set to my ships only. (The difference in price between max and purchase price goes back in my pocket)
A parked Atmospheric Lifter with freight drones removes goods (Manually) when I want to have more than the station's carry capacity.
When I need to outfit a ship, I pull up next to the lifter, send over the drones to retrieve goods and transporter them across.
I don't have to go searching for goods around the universe to outfit ships. They are brought to me automatically.
(Note, This convenience does not MAKE money, it costs money)
CAg has it's own blacklist. You will want to blacklist war sectors and any sectors that will cause the pilot to fly through the war sectors.
External CLS is good on a fighter with decent cargo hold (Falcon Hauler).
If you homebase the fighter on a carrier type ship and set it to buy energy, the carrier ship can be used as a flying refueling station for capitals via a transporter device. (I believe supply command software allows you to refuel ships if you don't like to use the selection bar for a transfer amount via transporter)
Fly by and refuel. The CLS tops up what you take.
Park aforementioned carrier next to one of your SPP's, Drop a Jump beacon and refueling becomes easy for your slow capitals.
A spare Galleon(M1) or a Shrike(M7) stolen from a claim mission will do nicely.
Kirlack
Specoguey (14)
Specoguey (14)
Posted 10 years ago.
Kirkland, uh...I never have used the commercial agent before. I usually will just straight out trade/sell for highest, but now I have started to set up a CLS to sell products to waypoints at average price. Could you just outline, you dont have to go into deep detail, what the cag is? Please? and how do you keep track of what they are doing so you can tell if you are making a profit?
- redheart
- redheart
CAG is a much improved automatic trader for your factories, basically. As I said above, a single CAG can handle buy/sell for multiple wares (although realistically you still want 2-3 per factory), and they run on the same style level progression as CLS pilots (i.e. they can use jumpdrives from level 4, and CAG/CLS levels are interchangeable. Many of my distributing CLS pilots in the com-save networks started off as CAGs for the 1Mj shield fab). And also, like the CLS, they will buy drones/mosquitoes when they reach a certain level, allowing them some measure of defense.
Keeping track of their profits is very simple. CAG script cannot be started unless the ship has been assigned a homebase, and so all expenditure/profits are reflected by the station's account. You'll see for yourself how effective they are when you get the com-save
One thing worth noting: If you use the keyboard at any stage during the CAG set up (to navigate the menus, not for inputting amounts etc), there is a chance the CAG simply won't work. It's only a minor bug, but it's damn annoying. Use the mouse to initialize it, and like a well set up CLS, it should run forever without further intervention.
Madder than a Bastard on fathers day.
My DiDs: Peace(s) of Eight - Way of the Gun - Status: Online, A Xenon DiD
My DiDs: Peace(s) of Eight - Way of the Gun - Status: Online, A Xenon DiD
redheart
Eagleguey (11)
Eagleguey (11)
Posted 10 years ago.
I have set up two so far. Could you take a look at the settings for me? I would really like them to be vendors for my products as I have a self sufficient complex and do not need them to buy anything for it. Just point out anything that is not correct for me and I will correct it. These two pilots are top leveled CLS Logicians so they will do everything for CAG.
First step
Trader Information..This ship sat in complex for a bit while I tried to figure out this so that is why the hire time and fly time is so out of wack.
Jump drive Settings
Trader Range
Second step I added what sectors they are to remain OUT of. This is due to the xenon and war sectors.
Third step was to set up the list of wares that the CAG is to sell. These are all produced at my main complex.
Finally we see the Trade Duties. This is where I am not positive on the settings, remember I want him to sell more then buy as I don't need anything brought in. These are the same settings I used for the second CAG as well. I just saved it and then loaded it onto the second one.
Should you see anything wrong, please point it out loud and clear lol.
This ship is supposed to be a storage container but it isnt working right. The products are sitting in the station and it wont manufacture more because it hit its limit. This is set up with CLS as you can see. Do you see what I did wrong?
Thanks a lot for your time and help.
First step
Trader Information..This ship sat in complex for a bit while I tried to figure out this so that is why the hire time and fly time is so out of wack.
Jump drive Settings
Trader Range
Second step I added what sectors they are to remain OUT of. This is due to the xenon and war sectors.
Third step was to set up the list of wares that the CAG is to sell. These are all produced at my main complex.
Finally we see the Trade Duties. This is where I am not positive on the settings, remember I want him to sell more then buy as I don't need anything brought in. These are the same settings I used for the second CAG as well. I just saved it and then loaded it onto the second one.
Should you see anything wrong, please point it out loud and clear lol.
This ship is supposed to be a storage container but it isnt working right. The products are sitting in the station and it wont manufacture more because it hit its limit. This is set up with CLS as you can see. Do you see what I did wrong?
Thanks a lot for your time and help.
redheart
Eagleguey (11)
Eagleguey (11)
Posted 10 years ago.
Hhmmm....must remember to have transporter devices on CAG ships or they will sit in stand by mode.....
Bump for opinion about above post.
Bump for opinion about above post.
Zipmeister
Fightguey (6)
Fightguey (6)
Posted 10 years ago.
This is the case for Universe Traders at least. Unless there is a different implementation for CAg Blacklists (Which may be), You will probably want to do the same for them. Better safe than sorry till there is confirmation to the contrary.
Add ALL war sectors.
Add all sectors for which the closest jump route takes them through a war sector.
In my game, I had to blacklist Mars, Jupiter, Jupiter2 and Jupiter 3 because they DO fly through blacklisted war sectors (Jupiter, Asteroid belt)to do business in non-blacklisted sectors...
Yes, They (UT's) are that dumb.
Blacklist does NOT keep them out of sectors. It keeps them from doing business IN those sectors.
Because I have a Jump beacon in "The Moon" I didn't have to blacklist Venus, Mercury or Earth. Otherwise, I would have needed them on the list also. The south gate of Asteroid belt would have been the closest jump point otherwise.
I have a Jump Beacon in Saturn also, So there are no "Shortcuts through war sectors" for the rest of Terran Space.
As I understand it, Jump Beacon locations are random. Your blacklist requirements will probably be different.
If I had a couple more jump beacons, putting one in Jupiter 2 and one in Mars would allow me to remove Jupiter2, Jupiter3, and Mars from my blacklist.
Can anyone confirm CAg blacklists function the same as UT blacklists?
Add ALL war sectors.
Add all sectors for which the closest jump route takes them through a war sector.
In my game, I had to blacklist Mars, Jupiter, Jupiter2 and Jupiter 3 because they DO fly through blacklisted war sectors (Jupiter, Asteroid belt)to do business in non-blacklisted sectors...
Yes, They (UT's) are that dumb.
Blacklist does NOT keep them out of sectors. It keeps them from doing business IN those sectors.
Because I have a Jump beacon in "The Moon" I didn't have to blacklist Venus, Mercury or Earth. Otherwise, I would have needed them on the list also. The south gate of Asteroid belt would have been the closest jump point otherwise.
I have a Jump Beacon in Saturn also, So there are no "Shortcuts through war sectors" for the rest of Terran Space.
As I understand it, Jump Beacon locations are random. Your blacklist requirements will probably be different.
If I had a couple more jump beacons, putting one in Jupiter 2 and one in Mars would allow me to remove Jupiter2, Jupiter3, and Mars from my blacklist.
Can anyone confirm CAg blacklists function the same as UT blacklists?
Kirlack
Specoguey (14)
Specoguey (14)
Posted 10 years ago.
Your CAG set up looks good, redheart The only thing I would change is in his Trade Duties. If you set 'Purchase Rsources' to either 0% or 101% it should turn it off (so he won't EVER buy resources). You could do the same with 'Sell Intermediate Resources', but you want to sell Energy Cells?
As to your CLS, you need to change the 'load 668 Hammer Heavy Torpedo' to 'load up to 668 Hammer Heavy Torpedo'. Using the up to command means he will take whatever is there, until his cargo bay is full (presumably at the 668 torps mark). At the moment he's trying to wait until there are exactly 668 torps in stock, then taking them all.
The only thing I would change is in his Trade Duties. If you set 'Purchase Rsources' to either 0% or 101% it should turn it off (so he won't EVER buy resources). You could do the same with 'Sell Intermediate Resources', but you want to sell Energy Cells?
As to your CLS, you need to change the 'load 668 Hammer Heavy Torpedo' to 'load up to 668 Hammer Heavy Torpedo'. Using the up to command means he will take whatever is there, until his cargo bay is full (presumably at the 668 torps mark). At the moment he's trying to wait until there are exactly 668 torps in stock, then taking them all.
Madder than a Bastard on fathers day.
My DiDs: Peace(s) of Eight - Way of the Gun - Status: Online, A Xenon DiD
My DiDs: Peace(s) of Eight - Way of the Gun - Status: Online, A Xenon DiD
redheart
Eagleguey (11)
Eagleguey (11)
Posted 10 years ago.
Thanks Kirklack. I missed that, I dont know what I was thinking. I really appreciate your help with the fine tuning. And yes, right now I do want to sell the Solar Cells. I have over abundance of them at this time.
redheart
Eagleguey (11)
Eagleguey (11)
Posted 10 years ago.
Ok I obtained a Heavy Dragon and am wondering either sell it or spec it out for war. If you say spec it out, what would you put on this ship? I am really not sure what to do with it. I am thinking Ion Shards for capital ships with some Flak for fighter defense.
Kirlack
Specoguey (14)
Specoguey (14)
Posted 10 years ago.
ISRs up front (maybe some EBCs as well to offset the drainage on the weapons generator?) is usually a good bet on the Heavy Dragon. I like PBGs in the top turret, set to 'attack my target', as they'll then fire forward 90+% of the time
You can't equip Flak cannons to any M6 though dude
You can't equip Flak cannons to any M6 though dude
Madder than a Bastard on fathers day.
My DiDs: Peace(s) of Eight - Way of the Gun - Status: Online, A Xenon DiD
My DiDs: Peace(s) of Eight - Way of the Gun - Status: Online, A Xenon DiD
RandomTank
Assoguey (17)
Assoguey (17)
Posted 10 years ago.
I found that 8 EBC's on the front is pretty effective, with PBG's in the turret (Kirlack converted me!), although you won't be able to store many E-cells for jumping around that way. In AP, it's generator is frikking mean, so it can support 8 ISR for quite a while, but if you want to fire for a bit longer, try 8 CIGs (bit less DPS, but they're still bloody effective!) and let the PBG's deal with the fighters. My biggest gripe with the Heavy Dragon is the steering, so in my Modified TC/AP games I buff it to 3.9 steering (with the cheat pack) but make it cost 2mill + tunings more; Cheating? You decide...
I will be the one to take you down!
redheart
Eagleguey (11)
Eagleguey (11)
Posted 10 years ago.
Are the PBG's only available through pirate sectors? I may need to get some assistance in hacking their system so I can dock.
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